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	<title>Comments on: BoG Holds Extraordinary Meeting to Pass CUS Fee</title>
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	<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/</link>
	<description>Separating the wheat from the chaff.</description>
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		<title>By: pouillet</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9930</link>
		<dc:creator>pouillet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Apr 2010 17:12:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9930</guid>
		<description>The timing for the Board simply reflect proper governance: the Board did not feel appropriate to endorse the project before the Student Societies ratified it. Waiting for the June Board would have meant delaying the project by a year given that disruptive work should take place over the summer. Waiting one year would be both a waste of time and a waste of money: construction costs are still at an all time low but this will change.
Conspiracy theorists, get a grip! I just posted a few Q&amp;A on my blog to bring some common sense here. http://blogs.ubc.ca/theadministration/2010/04/26/sauder-facts-and-fiction/
Pierre ze VP</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The timing for the Board simply reflect proper governance: the Board did not feel appropriate to endorse the project before the Student Societies ratified it. Waiting for the June Board would have meant delaying the project by a year given that disruptive work should take place over the summer. Waiting one year would be both a waste of time and a waste of money: construction costs are still at an all time low but this will change.<br />
Conspiracy theorists, get a grip! I just posted a few Q&amp;A on my blog to bring some common sense here. <a href="http://blogs.ubc.ca/theadministration/2010/04/26/sauder-facts-and-fiction/" rel="nofollow">http://blogs.ubc.ca/theadministration/2010/04/26/sauder-facts-and-fiction/</a><br />
Pierre ze VP</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Carne</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9929</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Carne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 21:56:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9929</guid>
		<description>All items reportedly passed at the Committees meeting today. The items are to be circulated electronically for Full Board approval at a time TBD. (see: http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/2010/01/11/board-of-governors-invents-voting-procedure/)
A few interesting points:
1. The Provost and VP Students were tasked with checking the fee with AvEd before this will go to full board. This exposes an opportunity to raise concerns with the Ministry, and I feel there&#039;s a good chance it&#039;ll be thrown out.
2. Apparently there was little-to-no concern around the table about the precedent this sets, and in fact one Board member reportedly spoke up about how it&#039;s &#039;fantastic&#039; students want to pay for academic buildings.
3. The reason given for why this has to be done so fast is so that seismic upgrades can be done over the summer. If this is true, I would prefer to see  a Board 3 revised approval for just Phase I and seismic, with a separate Board 3 for Phase II at the May/June Board meeting. This would allow the CUS time to try to negotiate any changes to the building that they desire, and would at least provide the appearance of being more transparent.
4. Reportedly the final approval also hinges upon Commerce and the University being &#039;on the same page&#039; as well as student by-in, but somehow I&#039;m not sure I believe them.
The tuition-related fix apparently had &quot;International&quot; written instead of &quot;Domestic&quot;, which was fixed at the meeting, and apparently is all correct now with no changes of substance.
Peter: Trust me, there was great debate about moral responsibility, but when it came down to it, it appeared that we were *legally bound* to vote yes (or abstain). The wording of this bylaw was more specific than the Student Court one, and there appeared to be no reasonable wiggle room.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All items reportedly passed at the Committees meeting today. The items are to be circulated electronically for Full Board approval at a time TBD. (see: <a href="http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/2010/01/11/board-of-governors-invents-voting-procedure/" rel="nofollow">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/2010/01/11/board-of-governors-invents-voting-procedure/</a>)</p>
<p>A few interesting points:<br />
1. The Provost and VP Students were tasked with checking the fee with AvEd before this will go to full board. This exposes an opportunity to raise concerns with the Ministry, and I feel there&#8217;s a good chance it&#8217;ll be thrown out.<br />
2. Apparently there was little-to-no concern around the table about the precedent this sets, and in fact one Board member reportedly spoke up about how it&#8217;s &#8216;fantastic&#8217; students want to pay for academic buildings.<br />
3. The reason given for why this has to be done so fast is so that seismic upgrades can be done over the summer. If this is true, I would prefer to see  a Board 3 revised approval for just Phase I and seismic, with a separate Board 3 for Phase II at the May/June Board meeting. This would allow the CUS time to try to negotiate any changes to the building that they desire, and would at least provide the appearance of being more transparent.<br />
4. Reportedly the final approval also hinges upon Commerce and the University being &#8216;on the same page&#8217; as well as student by-in, but somehow I&#8217;m not sure I believe them.</p>
<p>The tuition-related fix apparently had &#8220;International&#8221; written instead of &#8220;Domestic&#8221;, which was fixed at the meeting, and apparently is all correct now with no changes of substance.</p>
<p>Peter: Trust me, there was great debate about moral responsibility, but when it came down to it, it appeared that we were *legally bound* to vote yes (or abstain). The wording of this bylaw was more specific than the Student Court one, and there appeared to be no reasonable wiggle room.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9928</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 20:53:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9928</guid>
		<description>Sigh. Abrogation of moral responsibility in the face of established bureaucratic procedure?
Maybe, but I can see the point. Not like it, mind you, but see it nonetheless.
Though, the same used to be said of the Council&#039;s inability to reject Student Court motions... until it first tabled them (ignore) and later voted them down (reject) [if I recall correctly].
Thanks for the info and great article Andrew!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sigh. Abrogation of moral responsibility in the face of established bureaucratic procedure?</p>
<p>Maybe, but I can see the point. Not like it, mind you, but see it nonetheless.</p>
<p>Though, the same used to be said of the Council&#8217;s inability to reject Student Court motions&#8230; until it first tabled them (ignore) and later voted them down (reject) [if I recall correctly].</p>
<p>Thanks for the info and great article Andrew!</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Carne</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9927</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Carne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 20:13:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9927</guid>
		<description>Peter,
Council did in fact approve the fee. It was felt that according to the way the AMS Bylaws are written, the only grounds Council has to reject a student fee are if procedure was not followed correctly. Since they did in fact follow the procedural rules set forth in the Bylaws, Council was obligated to approve the fee for submission to Board.
That said, the majority of Councilors abstained in protest of the nature of the fee, and a lengthy discussion was had. Ideas regarding authoring a letter to AvEd were also tossed around, but as I&#039;m no longer on Council I&#039;m not sure if those are being pursued or not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peter,</p>
<p>Council did in fact approve the fee. It was felt that according to the way the AMS Bylaws are written, the only grounds Council has to reject a student fee are if procedure was not followed correctly. Since they did in fact follow the procedural rules set forth in the Bylaws, Council was obligated to approve the fee for submission to Board.</p>
<p>That said, the majority of Councilors abstained in protest of the nature of the fee, and a lengthy discussion was had. Ideas regarding authoring a letter to AvEd were also tossed around, but as I&#8217;m no longer on Council I&#8217;m not sure if those are being pursued or not.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9926</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 18:47:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9926</guid>
		<description>Oh, also, does this mean that the AMS Council passed/approved the Sauder fee as well?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, also, does this mean that the AMS Council passed/approved the Sauder fee as well?</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9925</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 12:05:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9925</guid>
		<description>You know what&#039;s also funny:
&quot;Dean Daniel Muzyka appointed Dean of Faculty of Management at UBC Okanagan&quot;
A friend of mine said it best:
&quot;Maybe the university there wanted to somehow get a new building?&quot;
...
Honestly, all this entire saga has taught me is that university administrations and investment banks have much more in common than one would have thought possible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know what&#8217;s also funny:<br />
&#8220;Dean Daniel Muzyka appointed Dean of Faculty of Management at UBC Okanagan&#8221;</p>
<p>A friend of mine said it best:<br />
&#8220;Maybe the university there wanted to somehow get a new building?&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;</p>
<p>Honestly, all this entire saga has taught me is that university administrations and investment banks have much more in common than one would have thought possible.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9924</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 08:41:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9924</guid>
		<description>Interesting... seems like they don&#039;t need all $500 anymore since the mortgage amount just went down by 10%. Either they can reduce payments by $50 to $450, or they can use the extra $50 per student to prepay the mortgage.
Any basic mortgage calculator will tell you that the additional prepayments ($50*2700 students) could reduce the mortgage from 35 years to 26 years. I wonder if letting students off the hook by 2036 is sufficient.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting&#8230; seems like they don&#8217;t need all $500 anymore since the mortgage amount just went down by 10%. Either they can reduce payments by $50 to $450, or they can use the extra $50 per student to prepay the mortgage.</p>
<p>Any basic mortgage calculator will tell you that the additional prepayments ($50*2700 students) could reduce the mortgage from 35 years to 26 years. I wonder if letting students off the hook by 2036 is sufficient.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Lougheed</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9923</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Lougheed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 08:33:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9923</guid>
		<description>A big question: Will UBC be waiting for the Province to give the thumbs up before going ahead? In 2007 they broke ground expecting the Province to say yes, but they said no, and boy did it get &#039;em into a pickle.
Angus docket item has some gems in it:
&quot;Project commenced prior to establishment of firm sustainability targets.&quot; [in 2007?
UBC didn&#039;t care about sustainability in 2007?
&quot;Cyclical Maintenance: $642,500/yr. Funding Source: Student Fees&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A big question: Will UBC be waiting for the Province to give the thumbs up before going ahead? In 2007 they broke ground expecting the Province to say yes, but they said no, and boy did it get &#8216;em into a pickle.</p>
<p>Angus docket item has some gems in it:</p>
<p>&#8220;Project commenced prior to establishment of firm sustainability targets.&#8221; [in 2007?</p>
<p>UBC didn&#8217;t care about sustainability in 2007?</p>
<p>&#8220;Cyclical Maintenance: $642,500/yr. Funding Source: Student Fees&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Carne</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9922</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Carne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 08:21:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9922</guid>
		<description>The Banker: I believe the Faculty is the ones arranging the financing, as students generally do not conduct their own negotiations with Treasury. Thus, if the financing is not coming through as expected, that would be the Dean/Faculty&#039;s responsibility and not students.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Banker: I believe the Faculty is the ones arranging the financing, as students generally do not conduct their own negotiations with Treasury. Thus, if the financing is not coming through as expected, that would be the Dean/Faculty&#8217;s responsibility and not students.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Lougheed</title>
		<link>http://ubcinsiders.ca/2010/04/bog-holds-extraordinary-meeting-to-pass-cus-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-9921</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Lougheed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Apr 2010 07:52:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.ubc.ca/ubcinsiders/?p=2974#comment-9921</guid>
		<description>If &quot;phase&quot; means &quot;standalone project&quot;, and if Phase 1 was built alone, the building would be vacated indefinitely as it wouldn&#039;t be meeting seismic code.
If &quot;phase&quot; doesn&#039;t mean &quot;standalone project&quot;... what does it mean?
Hope someone can attend the meeting. I&#039;ve got an exam.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If &#8220;phase&#8221; means &#8220;standalone project&#8221;, and if Phase 1 was built alone, the building would be vacated indefinitely as it wouldn&#8217;t be meeting seismic code.</p>
<p>If &#8220;phase&#8221; doesn&#8217;t mean &#8220;standalone project&#8221;&#8230; what does it mean?</p>
<p>Hope someone can attend the meeting. I&#8217;ve got an exam.</p>
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